The Executive Case for Permanent Standard Time: Why Aligning With Natural Light Is a Competitive Advantage
Twice a year, millions of Americans change their clocks. For most, it's a minor inconvenience. Nothing more than a ritual shrugged off with coffee and a complaint.
But beneath that small disruption lies one of the most overlooked performance drainers in modern life: misalignment between our biology and our timekeeping.
It’s easy to assume this is an issue for policy makers or sleep researchers. But as Jay Pea, founder of Save Standard Time, revealed during our recent conversation, the debate over permanent Standard Time isn’t merely a matter of preference. It’s also a matter of public health, safety, cognition, and long-term human performance.
And when you zoom out far enough, it becomes clear: This is a leadership issue as well.
And that’s because leaders operate on margin, therefore, the quality of their decisions depends on the quality of their biology.
Permanent Standard Time is about alignment. And that alignment is an advantage.
This is the playbook every high-performing leader should understand.
Watch The Episode with Jay Pea
1. Why Timekeeping Became Disconnected From Biology
Humans kept time by the sun long before clocks existed. For the majority of history, noon was when the sun stood highest in the sky. That natural rhythm shapes an individual's sleep, metabolism, alertness, and cognitive performance.
But in the modern era, timekeeping drifted from biology.
Enter Daylight Saving Time, where initially pushed by retail and golf lobbyists—not health experts—DST forced entire populations to wake an hour earlier in the dark, often without going to bed earlier.
The results weren’t benign.
According to Pea, DST is “a trick to make you wake up an hour earlier,” and its cumulative impact is measurable:
A spike in heart attacks the day after “spring forward.”
Increased workplace injuries
Higher rates of morning traffic accidents
Lower mood, impaired decision-making, and worsened sleep quality
When timekeeping became a social construct rather than a biological one, performance dropped—quietly, invisibly, and predictably.
2. Permanent Standard Time Supports Biological Accuracy
Standard Time is not arbitrary. It is designed to align your clock with the position of the sun— specifically, morning light, which serves as your body’s master circadian cue.
Morning sunlight:
Raises cortisol at the right time
Suppresses melatonin
Increases alertness
Improves metabolic regulation
Anchors your entire circadian rhythm
As Pea explains: “Standard Time aligns the day more closely to our circadian rhythms naturally.”
Permanent Standard Time health benefits extend far beyond sleep. Research now links circadian alignment to reductions in obesity, stroke risk, mood disorders, and decision fatigue.
Leaders spend millions trying to optimize performance. Yet one of the simplest levers, aligning with natural light, remains unaddressed in most organizations.
3. The Hidden Cost of Daylight Saving Time for Leaders and Teams
Leaders often underestimate the compounding cost of micro-fatigue.
DST disrupts the foundational rhythm that keeps your cognitive performance sharp. When teams wake in darkness, commute before sunrise, or rely on artificial light during their most critical hours, subtle deficits appear:
Slower strategic thinking
Reduced impulse control
Lower emotional regulation
Increased errors
Reduced creativity
The further an executive drifts from their natural light alignment, the more energy they must expend simply to maintain a baseline output. Performance debt is real, and DST amplifies it.
4. The Safety and Health Argument: It's Bigger Than Convenience
Perhaps the most striking point Pea made was about schoolchildren.
Under permanent DST, most states would experience winter sunrises after 8:30 AM, meaning children would walk to school in darkness. Historically, whenever permanent DST has been attempted (the U.S. in the 1970s, Russia in the 2010s), morning accidents and injuries increased sharply.
But this logic applies across all age groups.
Workers starting early shifts become more fatigued
Commuters drive in lower visibility
Reaction speed decreases
Hormonal signaling is mistimed
Health declines not in dramatic crashes, but in slow, compounding erosion, and thus affects everything from metabolism to mood.
These are the Permanent Standard Time health benefits often overlooked: safety, clarity, resilience, energy, and longevity.
5. The Leadership Lens: Why Permanent Standard Time Is a Strategic Advantage
Elite leaders think in terms of systems, not symptoms. Circadian alignment is a system-level variable. Here’s the leadership case:
A. Better Decisions Require Better Circadian Rhythm
Sleep quantity matters, but sleep timing matters just as much. Standard Time supports consistent, biology-aligned sleep cycles.
B. Culture Is Built on Energy, Not Intention
A fatigued workplace is a reactive workplace. Morning light improves morale, mood, and cognitive sharpness.
C. Healthier Teams Are More Productive Teams
Early-morning darkness correlates with more chronic disease, more stress, and more absenteeism.
D. Leaders Who Understand Biology Lead Better
A leader aligned with their natural rhythms operates with greater clarity, presence, and executive functioning.
If you want a competitive advantage that you can feel, not just measure, start by aligning with the sun, not the clock.
6. Why Permanent Standard Time Is the Most Practical Long-Term Solution
Some argue for permanent DST. But when pressed on the biological, safety, or historical data, the argument unravels. Permanent Standard Time is:
Scientifically aligned
Globally consistent with best practices
Safer for children and commuters
Superior for sleep and metabolic health
Supportive of long-term societal resilience
Pea summarized it: “Permanent Standard Time isn’t nostalgia. It’s biology.”
And biology always wins.
7. How Leaders Can Advocate for Better Time Policy
You don’t need to be in politics to support better time alignment. You can:
1. Educate your organization on circadian health.
Shift the culture from “hours” to “alignment.”
2. Support businesses using seasonal hours.
Many Arizona companies are already open earlier in the summer and later in the winter.
3. Encourage local or state-level conversations.
Most policymakers rarely hear from leaders. Your voice carries more weight than you think.
4. Align your own routine with natural light.
Your biology is the most immediate policy you can influence. A society aligned with natural light operates closer to its full capacity.
8. Pro Tips for Circadian Alignment (Even Before Permanent Standard Time Arrives)
Small shifts create disproportionate returns:
Get 5–10 minutes of natural light within 30 minutes of waking.
Dim indoor lights 90 minutes before bed.
Avoid intense evening illumination when possible.
Use morning walks as a leadership practice and a way to connect with family, rather than solely for exercise.
Make your winter routines slightly slower and more restorative.
Think of this as micro-alignment, essentially a quiet recalibration that enhances everything downstream.
Leadership Is Biological
High-performance leadership begins with alignment, and the sequence is your internal world before your external.
Permanent Standard Time isn’t merely a policy preference. It’s a reminder that our biology sets the terms. Leaders who understand this operate with more clarity, better decisions, steadier energy, and deeper resilience.
We lead better when we are aligned with nature. And nature, for all our complexity, is still our most trusted compass.
Interested in building a more aligned, biologically intelligent approach to your leadership and performance?
If you're ready to operate at your next level, reach out through our contact page, and let’s explore what elite, precision-guided health leadership looks like in practice.
Connect with Jay Pea
Website: https://savestandardtime.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/savestandard/
Jay’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jtheletter/
FAQ
What is Permanent Standard Time?
Permanent Standard Time means keeping your clocks aligned year-round with standard time rather than switching between Standard Time and Daylight Saving Time. It keeps your clock time more closely aligned with the sun’s position in the sky, especially in the morning.
Why is Permanent Standard Time better for our health?
Permanent Standard Time better aligns with our human circadian biology. Morning sunlight helps regulate your cortisol, melatonin, sleep timing, metabolism, mood, and cognitive performance—Daylight Saving Time delays morning light, which can disrupt these processes.
What are the health risks of Daylight Saving Time?
Research has linked Daylight Saving Time to increased sleep disruption, higher rates of heart attacks following clock changes, more traffic accidents, impaired cognitive performance, and worsened mood—especially after the spring transition.
How does Permanent Standard Time affect sleep?
Permanent Standard Time supports more consistent sleep timing by aligning wake times with natural morning light. This helps individuals fall asleep earlier, wake more naturally, and maintain healthier circadian rhythms over time.
Why does Daylight Saving Time increase accident risk?
DST increases accident risk by reducing morning light and increasing sleep deprivation. Darker mornings impair visibility and reaction time, especially for commuters and schoolchildren traveling early in the day.
Is Permanent Standard Time better for children and teens?
Yes. Children and adolescents are susceptible to circadian disruption. Permanent Standard Time provides more morning light, which improves alertness, learning, safety, and overall health—particularly during winter months.
Why was Daylight Saving Time created initially?
Daylight Saving Time was introduced during World War I and later promoted by retail and recreational industries. Contrary to popular belief, it was not created to help farmers and has not consistently provided energy savings.
Can businesses benefit from Permanent Standard Time?
Businesses can benefit from improved employee alertness, productivity, safety, and well-being. Aligning work schedules with natural circadian rhythms reduces fatigue and decision errors over time.
Why is ending clock changes complex at the state level?
Time zone borders and interstate commerce complicate state-level reform. However, regional agreements and contingent legislation can allow neighboring states to transition together.
How can individuals support Permanent Standard Time?
Individuals can support Permanent Standard Time by educating themselves, contacting state legislators, supporting advocacy organizations, and aligning personal routines with natural light exposure.
Jay Pea Conversation Transcript (May Not Be Exact)
Jay Pea
(0:00) So when the sun is lower in the sky, you have a different angle of sunlight. (0:05) The photons are passing through more molecules in the atmosphere. (0:10) And versus when the sun is higher in the sky, the, you know, it's a different angle, you're going to get a different wavelength, a different color of light.
(0:18) And these are giving different cues to your brain as you're absorbing light through your eyes. (0:23) So yes, yes, it's not just how much sunlight you're getting, but also the timing of the sunlight that's very important.
Julian Hayes II
(0:34) All right, twice a year, millions of people change their clocks. (0:38) And for many people, it feels like a minor inconvenience. (0:41) For others, it's a major inconvenience.
(0:43) For others, it makes no sense. (0:45) I'm probably in that camp. (0:47) And there's some people though, who are kind of mad about this because it's getting dark earlier and they can't go do whatever because it's dark or whatever excuse they use.
(0:56) But also though, what if those time changes are doing something for more harm than we realize? (1:04) And so today I'm joined by Jay Pea. (1:06) He's the founder of, he's the founder and president of Save Standard Time, which is a non-profit organization advocating for permanent standard time.
(1:14) His organization brings together scientists, sleep experts, and citizens to push for policies that align our schedules with our biology. (1:22) And then this is going to improve our sleep, our safety, and our public health. (1:26) So without further ado, Jay, how are you doing today?
Jay Pea
(1:30) Good morning. (1:31) It's good to be here. (1:32) Thanks for having me.
Julian Hayes II
(1:34) Yeah. (1:34) Well, I appreciate you joining me. (1:35) And so I have to ask a very important question.
(1:37) We have to start very seriously. (1:41) Amateur astronomer?
Jay Pea
(1:44) Yes, yes. (1:45) I'm an amateur astronomer. (1:46) I've got a six inch Dobsonian right there in the background and a smaller solar telescope as well, and some high power binoculars.
(1:56) I've always enjoyed not just viewing the stars, but paying attention to how the sun and the moon are moving throughout our sky as well.
Julian Hayes II
(2:05) So you can tell time based off those two things, right?
Jay Pea
(2:10) You can tell the time and the date based on the sun or the moon or the stars. (2:16) Yes.
Julian Hayes II
(2:16) Okay. (2:17) And what led to that fascination and interest with that?
Jay Pea
(2:24) Well, a couple of things. (2:25) I grew up in a rural environment in Iowa. (2:28) My great grandparents were farmers.
(2:30) And so when I was very young, I was taught to tell the time from where the sun is positioned in the sky. (2:36) Then also just growing up in the 80s, there were a lot of movies about science fiction that captured my imagination. (2:44) So I've always had an interest in this topic.
(2:48) To me, it's a natural science astronomy. (2:54) So it's bringing us closer to the natural world to understand the rhythms of the night and the day and the summer and the winter and how all these pieces fit together. (3:06) It's been said that we lived inside an enormous biological clock, the way that the earth is moving and the moon is moving, and then we're all moving around the sun like interconnected gears concentrically spinning inside a watch mechanism.
(3:29) I think it's a beautiful cosmic system.
Julian Hayes II
(3:35) And I'm also curious, as we're learning a bit about your background, how does a former software engineer find themselves doing what you're doing now?
Jay Pea
(3:44) Well, whenever the clock changes would occur, my friends would gripe about it, and I would try to explain, well, you're correct to gripe about the spring forward, or no, actually the fallback is a good move to make. (4:02) So it was always the topic of conversation. (4:05) When I'm in a DST observing state, I keep my wristwatch set to standard time, and people sometimes notice.
(4:11) They say, hey, why is your clock an hour slow? (4:13) And I would say, well, actually yours is an hour fast. (4:17) And so around 2019, there was this great push for permanent daylight time coming out of Florida.
(4:25) And so friends were asking me, what is this about? (4:27) Is this a good move or a bad move? (4:29) And as I looked into it, I discovered, no, this is a bad move.
(4:33) And so I started to make some noise about it, write some letters, make some phone calls. (4:38) And before I knew it, I was building a website, creating a Twitter account, founding a 501c4, and testifying before state legislatures.
Julian Hayes II
(4:51) So how was testifying before state legislators, I guess, for the very first time?
Jay Pea
(4:56) It was a terribly difficult experience for me. (5:00) I'm not a natural public speaker. (5:03) I've learned a lot over the last six years and have become a little more accustomed to it.
(5:10) But still, it's a very strange thing at first, but you can get accustomed to it. (5:18) When I was a software engineer, you never had to wear a suit, for example, and now I'm quite comfortable wearing suits. (5:25) And you have to try to get your message distilled down to as brief as possible, make it into an elevator pitch, try to translate the jargon into relatable terms and these sorts of things.
(5:41) And then it's also been fascinating to see how these conversations occur when the cameras are off as well. (5:47) As I visit these capitals across the states and in D.C., having these conversations with the legislators and their staff, some people have said that it's akin to seeing how sausages are made, for example.
Julian Hayes II
(6:08) And so I'm curious, is this issue so difficult for, I guess, politicians and legislators to grasp? (6:19) Is it because they don't understand the science behind it or there's a lot of other nuanced issues that goes into it as well, probably like financial incentives and stuff with having clocks and having more daylight in the evening?
Jay Pea
(6:35) It's largely confusing to most people in general, time being an intangible object. (6:44) It leads to people saying, well, I don't know. (6:47) I know I don't like to change the clocks.
(6:50) Let's just pick one and stick with it. (6:52) And then they often say, I like the summertime. (6:55) Can we keep the one in summer year round?
(6:57) Will that somehow make winter be more like summer? (7:00) And I'm sad to share that you can't magically turn the winter into summer just by changing your clock an hour ahead. (7:08) The difficulty most of us have with winter is the lack of daylight.
(7:12) The sun is coming up later and it's setting earlier. (7:16) Now, if you spring forward and stay there, then you're going to get even less light in the morning. (7:23) So winter medically can be depressive to the mood, most notably due to the lack of morning daylight.
(7:34) Seeing the sun in the morning stimulates the release of cortisol and suppresses the release of melatonin. (7:40) It helps you feel awake and alert and ready to make your breakfast, drive your car, start your work or learn in school. (7:48) We need that morning sunlight most of all.
(7:51) If you're and you'll feel sluggish into the day and then you might even have trouble falling asleep at the end of the day. (7:59) If we kept daylight saving time, if we kept daylight time permanent, the sun would be coming up after eight in the morning for more than three months out of the year in most states. (8:14) It would be delayed until 8.45 or later in most states. (8:19) Now, most people are starting school or work at eight o'clock or earlier. (8:23) So that would be essentially a hidden government mandate to wake an hour early in the cold dark and start your day, start your work day, not just waking up in the dark, but going indoors before the sun has even risen. (8:36) And when we've tried that historically, we find that it leads to chronic depression and an increase in accidents.
(8:42) It's essentially a population-wide experiment in several weeks of drowsy driving when we try permanent daylight saving time. (8:50) We tried it in the United States, most famously in 1974, in an attempt to save energy during the oil crisis. (8:57) Russia tried it from 2011 to 2014.
(9:01) Britain tried it in the 60s and it doesn't work out. (9:05) And we end up just going, we end up realizing that we have to stop doing permanent daylight time. (9:11) And then in the U.S., we went back to our current operation of seasonal clock change. (9:17) In Russia, they bit the bullet and they said, we're going to go to permanent standard time. (9:21) And that's where they've been ever since. (9:26) So if you really want to end the clock change, historically and scientifically, and just back to first principles, we really should be choosing the objective measurement of time.
(9:35) We should be aligning the clock as closely as possible to where the sun is positioned in the sky. (9:40) And then if individuals and businesses really do want to start their work day and hour earlier, which is what DST is forcing you to do, then let those businesses and individuals choose to do that as much as possible and practical, keeping the standard time.
Julian Hayes II
(9:59) What's the origination of this time changes? (10:03) Where did this come from?
Jay Pea
(10:05) It started during World War I. (10:08) And even before that, in the late 19th century, in 1883, we had the locomotive steam engine and we had the telegraph, and we were noticing that under solar time, where the sun is, where the clock is really aligned perfectly to the sun, that's solar time, where 12 p.m. and high noon are perfectly aligned. (10:32) That's what we were doing for centuries.
(10:34) But it means that every town, east to west, has a slightly different time, off by a few minutes. (10:41) So, like, if the sun were overhead in Louisiana, it'd be 12 noon, say, in New Orleans. (10:50) But in Montgomery, Alabama, the sun was overhead just 15 minutes ago, so it would be 12.15 there. (10:58) And over in Texas, the sun hasn't yet reached that far west, so it'd be maybe a quarter until 12 in Texas. (11:05) So, rather than have these three states on different clocks, they decided to standardize the time. (11:11) They decided to draw meridians across the globe, separated by one-hour offsets from the Royal Observatory in Greenwich, England.
(11:21) 360 degrees divided by 24 hours comes to 15 degrees wide for each zone. (11:27) So, instead of Louisiana and Mississippi and Alabama and Texas all having different times, they just round them off to the same time. (11:39) They standardized the solar time, so it will all be 12 o'clock when the sun is overhead the 90th degree of longitude, which happens to run through about New Orleans or St. Louis. (11:52) So, in 1883, we standardized solar time to the 24 standard time zones. (11:58) And under that system, we are fudging things slightly. (12:03) Your clock might be off from the sun by as much as 30 minutes, but that's still good enough.
(12:10) It's still pretty good. (12:11) We're not telling outright lies about what time it is with standard time. (12:17) It's the perfect balance between keeping things strictly ideal with solar time and trying to be practical with the increasingly globalized society that is required with high-speed communications and transportation.
(12:32) However, in the early 20th century, people started to get a little creative with the social engineering. (12:41) They realized that, well, so in the winter, the sunrise can be as late as 8 o'clock in the morning, but in the summer, it can be as early as 4 o'clock in the morning. (12:51) And that means people in the summer are sleeping past the sunrise.
(12:56) And there was an argument made that we are wasting daylight by letting people sleep in. (13:02) And if we could somehow force people to wake up earlier, then they would go to work earlier. (13:07) They'd have more time after work for play, specifically for playing golf.
(13:12) And so, in 1917, in Britain and Germany, they decided they would start saving daylight. (13:22) In the summer, they would move the clock ahead an hour. (13:25) And that would mean your workday would start an hour earlier.
(13:28) And the argument was made that then you'd get an extra hour of productivity out of the workforce. (13:34) And hopefully, they'd go to bed an hour earlier, which would save on the power bill. (13:40) They would save coal and oil and electricity.
(13:43) But it turns out that just because you wake people up an hour earlier doesn't mean they go to bed an hour earlier. (13:49) So we actually end up wasting energy. (13:53) And you're less productive because you're getting less sleep.
(13:56) So it actually cuts into productivity. (13:59) So there's never been strong data behind increasing productivity or saving energy, the original reasons for daylight saving time. (14:08) Now, actually, the reason we have daylight saving time, so those were the excuses that were they would save energy and increase productivity.
(14:15) The reality was that the golf lobby wanted people to be leaving work early so they would go spend money playing golf. (14:24) And the retail shopping lobby, the department stores, wanted people to leave work early so they would go shopping in the evening an extra hour. (14:31) That's why we have daylight saving time.
(14:33) It's thanks to the lobbyists for golf and department stores in the early 20th century. (14:40) A lot of people think that it's for the farmers. (14:43) That was a myth that was invented by the Boston Chamber of Commerce.
(14:46) They published a document in 1917 called An Hour of Light for an Hour of Night, something like that. (14:52) They said, if we make the farmers harvest the crops an hour earlier, they'll have more dew on them, they'll be fresher and crisper. (15:01) And the farmers said, no, that's nonsense.
(15:04) We harvest crops after sunrise so the dew can dry off because it's easier to handle the crops when they're not wet. (15:13) But the myth caught on. (15:15) It's what people heard and believed.
(15:18) When the wars ended, these same lobbyists for golf and shopping brought it back. (15:24) They brought it back in mainly the cities of the mid-Atlantic region and New England, Boston and New York. (15:33) It started to come back in Chicago and in LA.
(15:39) And then it spread by the mid-20th century to the state level. (15:44) And by the 1960s, we had a real problem on our hands where some states were observing daylight saving time and some states were not. (15:51) And those that were observing daylight saving time were doing it on a different schedule.
(15:55) You didn't know if you're springing forward on the Sunday after Easter or the Sunday after Memorial Day. (16:01) And this was confusing to transportation and commerce. (16:05) So Congress was forced to step in.
(16:08) And unfortunately, they sided with the city folk and the lobbyists and said, OK, now all states are going to do daylight saving time. (16:15) We're going to unify the schedule. (16:17) So we're all springing forward and pulling back on the same day.
(16:19) And this will reduce confusion, which was true. (16:23) And so in 1965, a dozen states were doing DST. In 1966, almost all states were now forced to be doing daylight saving time. (16:36) Now, Congress did provide an option to exempt yourself.
(16:40) And that's how Arizona and Hawaii and the five territories currently avoid the clock change. (16:45) Any state can pass a state law saying we will not observe daylight saving time and we will stick to standard time. (16:52) The challenge with this is most state legislators don't know that that's an option.
(16:58) And those that do worry about creating new time zone boundaries. (17:03) If the state of Missouri were to self-exempt from DST, then Kansas City, the metropolitan area, would be divided by a new time zone with Kansas not doing DST or doing DST in Missouri. (17:15) You see the problem.
(17:16) If Missouri went its own way, but Illinois did not, then St. Louis metropolitan area would be divided in half. (17:21) So a lot of state legislators just find it too challenging and confusing and throw their hands up and point it to Congress. (17:28) Then Congress points back to the states and we have a stalemate.
Julian Hayes II
(17:32) Huh. (17:32) It's interesting because I'm in Tennessee. (17:34) So I'm in Tennessee.
(17:36) And so we our state has Eastern on the on once you get closer to Knoxville, you're going to have Eastern Standard. (17:43) I'm on Central Standard. (17:44) So if they were going to change that, then they would have to.
(17:49) So I guess then they would have confusion with the people on the eastern border of the state.
Jay Pea
(17:55) Yes.
Julian Hayes II
(17:57) Huh. (17:57) OK. (17:58) And so that's why a lot of times nothing gets changed because I've always wondered how places like Arizona and I think you mentioned Hawaii and how they can avoid those, how they avoided those things and just stay the same.
Jay Pea
(18:11) Right. (18:12) So it's easier for us in Arizona because most of our population lives in the center of the state near Phoenix. (18:17) We don't have major metropolitan areas on the borders.
(18:21) And of course, Hawaii being an island has no problem with the borders as well.
Julian Hayes II
(18:27) So for this to actually happen, it sounds like it's going to have to be a federal issue then.
Jay Pea
(18:34) Well, not exactly. (18:35) No. (18:35) So my nonprofit has begun to offer is on our Web site safe center time dot com.
(18:41) We do have a page of draft legislation, a bill for every single state. (18:47) And the key is that that when you when you're passing a state bill or exemption from daylight saving time, you need to make the effective date delayed contingent upon at least one neighboring state doing the same thing. (19:00) So, for example, you mentioned Tennessee.
(19:02) Our bill for Tennessee would say we're we're ready to exempt from DST as soon as Arkansas is. (19:10) And that would prevent the the Memphis metropolitan area getting divided by a new time zone. (19:15) So if Tennessee could pass that law, then I could go to Arkansas and say, hey, they're ready to do it.
(19:19) How about you? (19:20) And we can put together a regional solution in that way.
Julian Hayes II
(19:24) But wait a minute. (19:24) Wait a minute. (19:25) So, no, Memphis is Memphis is central, right?
(19:28) Yeah. (19:28) Memphis is central. (19:31) And then what about Knoxville?
(19:33) Knoxville will be Eastern Standard. (19:35) Right.
Jay Pea
(19:35) So, Tennessee, we would also want a contingency based on North Carolina and Georgia for the eastern zones because Chattanooga borders Georgia and Knoxville is very close to North Carolina. (19:51) You can also exempt each zone independently. (19:55) So the eastern time zone of Tennessee could lose DST while the central zone could continue to be doing the flip-flopping of flux.
(20:04) Oh, OK.
Julian Hayes II
(20:06) OK. (20:07) So now, OK, I guess it's a little hairy.
Jay Pea
(20:11) It does. (20:11) It's a tangled web that we weave. (20:14) And it is very it is it can be technically difficult and and practically difficult.
(20:21) But that's why we want to have bills with these contingencies built on each other so that we can put together a regional solution rather than having anyone state trying to go it alone.
Julian Hayes II
(20:33) That definitely makes sense then right there, because I can I can see how someone's going to argue this or or an easy excuse for someone to get out of this. (20:42) They're going to say, hey, I have these other issues that my delegation and people are are getting on me about. (20:50) I see the thing here, but I can't make it a priority because it's too difficult and I have these other things to worry about.
Jay Pea
(20:57) Yes. (20:58) And that's that's a very common response we hear is that people care about it, but they don't care about it as much as they do other issues. (21:04) It's a long priority queue.
Julian Hayes II
(21:06) But the interesting thing is, though, and which, you know, I've seen the advisors and the people that you have on board as well and yourself. (21:13) There's a lot of health issues with this. (21:16) And I think that's the thing that is still not fully grasped, that we have this this we have a obesity epidemic.
(21:25) We have all these chronic health issues in in America. (21:30) And it's not just food. (21:32) It's not just you're not working out enough.
(21:34) You're not just eating enough. (21:36) We're also our circadian rhythms are off.
Jay Pea
(21:38) Yes. (21:40) No, I often say that natural health is a three legged stool and you need a good diet and you need exercise and you need good sleep. (21:49) And so if one of those is missing, you're going to have a problem.
(21:53) Standard time is best for our sleep health because it aligns the day more closely to our circadian rhythms naturally. (22:01) And that darkness in the evening helps you get to sleep on time. (22:04) And having that sunrise in the morning helps you wake up naturally without an alarm clock.
Julian Hayes II
(22:10) Yeah. (22:11) And I think also and this is something that I probably over the last maybe 18 to 24 months really started to understand more and study more is that the sun at different periods of the day is going to offer different benefits for our health and everything like the rays that you get from a from a sunrise is going to be different than what you get at high noon. (22:31) And they offer unique health benefits for each one of those.
Jay Pea
(22:36) Yes. (22:36) So when the sun is lower in the sky, you have a different angle of sunlight. (22:41) The photons are passing through more molecules in the atmosphere and versus when the sun is higher in the sky.
(22:49) The you know, it's a different angle. (22:51) You're going to get a different wavelength, a different color of light. (22:54) And these are giving different cues to your brain as you're absorbing light through your eyes.
(22:59) So, yes, yes, it's not just how much sunlight you're getting, but also the timing of the sunlight. (23:05) That's very important.
Julian Hayes II
(23:07) Yeah. (23:08) And I think that's I know with the current administration, there's a health push and everything. (23:14) And I really hope that this is not forgotten in terms of the benefits of circadian rhythms and and really being aligned with nature.
(23:23) And that's the you know, to me, that's the foundation. (23:26) And then everything else builds from that.
Jay Pea
(23:28) And you mentioned obesity. (23:30) There was a study just about a month ago published in PNAS from doctors Weed and Zeitzer. (23:36) If I have the names right, I hope so.
(23:39) They were studying permanent standard time, permanent daylight time in the current situation of changing clocks. (23:45) And they found that permanent standard time would be much better for reducing obesity than than either of the two options. (23:53) Also much better for strokes.
(23:55) And, you know, this this very much makes sense to me. (23:59) When we're on standard time, you're getting more light in the morning, you're getting a better balance of light throughout the day. (24:05) And that just benefits your circadian rhythm.
(24:07) When you're when you have a good circadian rhythm, you you're you're making better decisions for one. (24:16) If you're lacking sleep, if you're feeling sluggish, you might be drawn toward foods that are not so good for you. (24:26) You might be rushing through your food instead of chewing it.
(24:29) And there's all sorts of reasons why this having a better alignment of circadian rhythm can benefit your diet and and the manifestation of that through maintaining a healthy weight.
Julian Hayes II
(24:46) Yeah. (24:46) I also imagine this is better for school kids as well, especially. (24:51) Yes.
Jay Pea
(24:51) Yes. (24:53) It's in school. (24:55) Children are very susceptible to disruptions in circadian rhythms.
(25:00) And also adolescents tend to have a later chronotype, tend to be more of an evening type, a night owl. (25:11) And when you're of that sort, you don't want to be awakened earlier in the morning in the dark, which is what daylight saving time makes us do. (25:20) You want to be sleeping, have a little bit more time for sleep in the morning, which is what standard time provides.
(25:26) So, yeah, permanent standard time is much better for your performance in the workplace and school, especially for your children. (25:33) And then also a key component that most people readily understand is that if if you're putting kids, sending them to school in the dark with daylight saving time, that increases their risk of falling victim to traffic accidents. (25:52) People are always sending me links to news headlines.
(25:56) We just had one a couple of weeks ago in Florida where a child was tragically struck on her way to school in the morning. (26:04) And it was something like it was seven thirty in the morning, eastern daylight time, and the sun had not risen yet. (26:11) And if she was on standard time, the sun would have already come up.
(26:15) There would have been more visibility on the road and the driver and the victim likely would have gotten an extra hour of sleep in the morning. (26:22) And those two factors could have prevented this death. (26:25) When we tried permanent DST in the past, we find that it does increase these morning car accidents and there seem to be more children on the road in the mornings than in the evenings.
Julian Hayes II
(26:37) Yeah, I think I saw this that and hopefully I'm getting it correct. (26:41) I think I wrote about it, but I probably forgot. (26:44) I think it's the day after transitioning from standard time to daylight saving time.
(26:51) The spring forward. (26:52) Yes. (26:52) Yeah.
(26:52) The spring forward. (26:53) There's a significant spike in heart attacks and traffic accidents.
Jay Pea
(26:57) Yes. (26:57) Yes. (27:00) It's incredibly.
(27:01) I think I've seen it's 20 percent or something like that. (27:04) It's a large number. (27:06) So yeah.
Julian Hayes II
(27:06) Yeah.
Jay Pea
(27:07) Yeah. (27:07) It's very apparent.
Julian Hayes II
(27:08) Yeah. (27:08) Because I think people are consistent. (27:11) People are getting even more in a sleep deficit by doing this.
Jay Pea
(27:15) Right. (27:15) So when we spring the clock forward, you have an acute reaction, you know, a sharp and short term reaction, a spike in these problems. (27:24) And when we have when we have the permanent daylight time, when we're keeping it, then we have a chronic or an ongoing problem.
(27:32) So it's it's there's there's two factors in this. (27:35) And most people only pay attention to the acute harm and don't realize that there's also a chronic harm. (27:41) Mm hmm.
Julian Hayes II
(27:43) I was just thinking that. (27:46) This just randomly came to me that from. (27:49) Do you think a big part of the resistance and maybe less attention given to this issue here is due to maybe perhaps how detached that we've become from nature in general?
Jay Pea
(28:03) Oh, yes, very much so. (28:05) I I'm the type of person who has a general sense of which direction is north and south. (28:14) And I'm surprised that I meet many people who don't feel that they don't they don't have a concept of which where the cardinal directions are.
(28:24) And similarly, I always have a general sense of what time of day it is, which you can tell from, you know, the the color of the sunlight and the length and direction of shadows. (28:36) And a lot of people just don't even notice these details.
Julian Hayes II
(28:39) Oh, I can see that I can see the sun idea because for me now I can there's a clear distinction since I've been outside so much now with, you know, how it's a little it's a cooler and warmer earlier in the morning. (28:52) So that's that's an easy indication for me. (28:55) And then even at sunset.
(28:58) But I didn't think about the length and the shadows. (29:00) That's a new one. (29:01) I didn't know.
Jay Pea
(29:02) Yeah. (29:02) And it can also be a clue to what time of year it is as well. (29:06) If you'll notice in the summer, the shadows are much shorter.
(29:10) And in the winter, the shadows are going to be longer because when the Earth is tilted away from the sun, that puts the sun at a lower position in the sky throughout the entire day. (29:21) The the sun reaches its zenith at at high noon, which would be at 12 p.m. solar time. (29:29) And if you're on standard time, hopefully within a half hour of 12 o'clock, the sun is going to be at its zenith, its zenith being its highest and most southerly point in the sky.
(29:38) Now, in the winter, when the Earth when the Earth is tilted away from the sun, that means the even though the sun is reaching its highest point in the sky, it's not very high compared to when it's the summertime and we're tilted toward the sun. (29:54) Then when the sun reaches its zenith at midday, it's higher up in the sky than it was at the same time of day in the winter. (30:02) And so when it's higher, you're going to have a shorter shadow on the ground.
(30:05) You're going to have a brighter and bluer quality of light. (30:09) And in the winter, you're going to have a longer shadow and you're going to have a softer and warmer hue of light. (30:17) So it's constantly changing every day of the year.
(30:22) It's just a beautiful ebb and flow of nature.
Julian Hayes II
(30:27) Yeah. (30:27) And so I'm thinking that also that it's not just time zones that that's being affected here. (30:36) It almost feels a little bit like I could sense like a cultural alignment or something that's just kind of being lost as well when we're not with these ebbs and flows of nature and changing these time zones are changing the clocks that goes against us.
(30:53) And so I think there's an element of culture that gets lost in that as well, if that makes sense.
Jay Pea
(30:58) Well, I mean, some people I see will complain. (31:00) They say, oh, it's so dark, so early in the winter. (31:02) And I say, well, I mean, it's winter.
(31:05) This is the time of year when you will be going indoors and lighting a fire and enjoying a cup of tea and singing Christmas carols and those sorts of things. (31:18) And in the summertime, the sun is out later. (31:21) And that's when you go outside and have your barbecue and your parties.
(31:27) And so, I mean, if winter were not short, if the days in winter were not short, you wouldn't appreciate the length of days in summer quite so much. (31:38) It's all part of this.
Julian Hayes II
(31:41) Yeah. (31:42) And winter is a time for more rest. (31:45) Your body's designed to get more rest during this time of the year because it's darker and it's signaling for you to rest more.
(31:52) And even your dietary patterns, for the most part, is supposed to change in the winter and summer. (31:58) Now, I'm guilty of not doing that. (32:00) But before we had the convenience of being able to have food shipped to us from wherever, if you live in certain places, you're not getting this type of food during the winter.
Jay Pea
(32:11) Right. (32:11) And I mean, it's more helpful to be eating seasonally, right? (32:16) So, if you're eating your summer peaches fresh in the winter that are shipped in from somewhere in South America, you know, that could be a little odd on the digestive track.
(32:31) You know, eating strawberries in the winter, it doesn't quite make as much sense. (32:37) In the winter, you want to be eating more of your pears and your apples and your squashes and these things. (32:44) So, yeah, it all is an interconnected system of diet and sleep and activity.
(32:53) Most animals are hibernating or going into some sort of relaxation or lower period of activity in the winter as well. (33:01) And if we try to rip ourselves out of this natural system, we may suffer consequences for it.
Julian Hayes II
(33:11) Here's what do you what I guess I guess there's two parts. (33:14) What role do you think businesses and organizations can play in supporting healthier time policies? (33:21) And do you think they even have the gravitas or even much weight to even have a voice in this?
Jay Pea
(33:30) Well, the lawmakers, they often want to hear what the business community thinks. (33:35) And so, I would ask anyone who has the ability to ask your business or your organization to endorse permanent standard time policy to put out a public statement. (33:49) The Indiana Chamber of Commerce just a few months ago put on the record that they would prefer permanent standard time if we were going to lock down the clocks.
(33:58) And I was thrilled to see that because most business people immediately think that they'd rather keep the summertime clock. (34:06) But the Indiana Chamber of Commerce was noting that if they kept permanent daylight time, the sun would be the sunrise would be delayed past nine o'clock in the morning. (34:15) And that's not good for morning businesses.
(34:19) It's not good for the productivity of workers overall in all sectors. (34:26) But most especially those who have to work in the morning, those who have to work outdoors, farmers, construction workers, they're working outdoors, they want that morning light when it's cooler outside, rather than trying to work in the evening when it's hotter outside. (34:42) But I mean, even just construction generally wants to get as much work done as possible before the rush hour begins.
(34:50) You need to be, you know, if you have a snowplow, you need to do that service before the rush hour begins. (34:56) So yes, business leaders, nonprofit organizations, we would love to see more public endorsements of permanent standard time policy. (35:05) Also, I mean, if you're just a small business, you could be adopting seasonal hours.
(35:11) I see this a lot in Arizona, that during the summertime, businesses will open an hour earlier and close an hour earlier. (35:19) And then in the winter, they'll go back to their usual schedule. (35:22) And I think it's a great way to be putting the power back in the hands of the local business of the local community, rather than having this top down mandate of we're going to change the clocks on this date and tough luck if you don't like it.
Julian Hayes II
(35:39) Now, I'm curious, is the Sunshine Protection Act, has that been removed yet? (35:47) Or is that still up in the air? (35:49) Oh, I wish.
Jay Pea
(35:51) So the Sunshine Protection Act in Congress was introduced in 2018. (35:58) And it failed. (36:00) And then it was reintroduced again.
(36:02) And it failed. (36:03) And it was reintroduced again. (36:04) And it failed.
(36:05) So they keep, Congress operates on a two year biennial session. (36:11) So currently, the current biennium is 2025-2026 cycle. (36:17) And so there is a current new Sunshine Protection Act, which would mandate permanent daylight saving time nationwide.
(36:24) We don't want that. (36:27) It was brought up for hearing earlier this year in April. (36:32) There were mixed results out of that.
(36:34) We had advocates for health and safety saying that there should be permanent standard time. (36:39) And then we had advocates for the golf associations saying they'd rather have permanent daylight time. (36:47) I don't really understand why we're putting golf and health and safety on equal footing.
(36:52) But that's not my decision. (36:54) There was a vote that followed later that same month. (36:58) And it was, it was kind of a, there was no clear consensus out of that.
(37:05) And then the table, the bill was sort of left on the table from there. (37:11) So it is technically still alive and viable, but it is stalled in committee. (37:16) We want to leave it stalled in committee or we want to defeat it.
(37:19) Now, just a week or two ago, the authors of the bill tried to bypass the and bring it to the floor to request a voice consent. (37:30) And thankfully, Senator Tom Cotton from Arkansas stood up and stopped that move citing again, the danger of an 830 sunrise would pose to the safety of school children and commuters and those who have to work outdoors in the morning. (37:47) So the daylight time proponents in Congress, they're still reaching and trying all the tricks that they can pull.
(37:58) But we are maintaining a strong defense against that. (38:02) What we really do need though, is a new permanent standard time bill to be passed in one of the states, or we need one introduced in Congress because most endorsers of permanent daylight time tell us that they don't really favor one clock or the other. (38:17) They just see this one bill being offered for daylight time.
(38:20) They want to end the clock change. (38:22) They sign on to it. (38:23) We need to give them the opportunity to endorse the alternative.
(38:27) We need to have a bill for permanent standard time that they can sign on to in addition or instead. (38:34) But then a challenge in Congress is they say, well, we need guidance from the states. (38:40) We want to see a state pass a bill that favors standard time.
(38:44) So it really is an issue that we need to tackle at both at the state level and the federal level simultaneously.
Julian Hayes II
(38:52) Maybe Tennessee can get their act together. (38:54) I don't know where Tennessee stands on that. (38:57) Does Tennessee stand on standard or permanent or have they just been quiet?
Jay Pea
(39:02) Well, so unfortunately when Florida passed the first permanent daylight bill in 2018, Tennessee and most of the Southeastern United States followed in the next year or two passing the same bill. (39:14) Now when they passed this bill, they didn't discuss, should we keep standard or daylight? (39:20) All they said was Florida did this.
(39:22) We want to get rid of the clock change. (39:24) Let's do the same thing.
Julian Hayes II
(39:25) Oh no. (39:26) I need to go have a talk with them.
Jay Pea
(39:29) Yes, please reach out to your state legislators and your members of Congress.
Julian Hayes II
(39:34) Yeah, I need to go talk to them or find a way. (39:39) Maybe I can get them on the podcast and have a talk with them.
Jay Pea
(39:42) I'd be glad to join that conversation. (39:44) Now we did have a bill for permanent standard time a couple of years ago in Tennessee. (39:49) It passed through its first committee, so that's pretty good, but then it got stalled I think on the floor or in the companion bill and there was a distraction with a school shooting that occurred tragically that year.
(40:04) We haven't seen any movement in Tennessee since then. (40:08) There's possible interest.
Julian Hayes II
(40:09) Okay. (40:10) I'm hearing also that, I guess there's a couple options. (40:14) We need more health-oriented people to get an office or we need to really find some way to educate and inform people beyond just economics, potential economics.
(40:32) Economics is great, but there's also economics with health as well that trickles down into people having to pay more for their health care now because- Right.
Jay Pea
(40:40) When most people talk about economics on this issue, they're usually just talking about the special interest of the golf blogging or they think that will increase shopping money or spending and such. (40:51) There's really not strong data showing that it would benefit golfer shopping to be on daylight time for one. (40:58) Then number two, daylight time is decreasing our productivity across all sectors.
(41:03) It's really not a good economic decision to adopt permanent DST. Yeah.
Julian Hayes II
(41:07) I think that people love money, especially business owners and corporate leaders. (41:12) I think if they've seen that enough and had that put in their face enough, I think that can start to sway them a little more or at least give it attention. (41:20) To me, it seems like it's a no-brainer, but it's just the awareness of it.
(41:26) It's just not fully there to fully grasp the severity of it.
Jay Pea
(41:30) Yes. (41:30) Most people, as I mentioned, don't really understand the issue and understandably so. (41:35) It's kind of a weird topic.
(41:38) Also, most people don't give it any thought or attention except twice a year. (41:42) It can be a challenge to get this information out to those involved.
Julian Hayes II
(41:48) Yeah. (41:48) Writing, you can see things like Google Trends and stuff and you always see certain topics that are going to have a huge spike at some times of the year and then it just goes back to being flatline. (42:00) Yeah.
(42:01) I'm curious, how has it been just as we get ready to wrap this up? (42:05) This is kind of a rapid fire question. (42:08) You had to pretty much transform and reinvent yourself, it sounds like, from being a software engineer to now getting out in public more, speaking more.
(42:20) You're always in a sharp suit. (42:21) I had to make sure I dressed up a little bit for the conversation because I knew you were going to be in your suit as well. (42:28) How has that been leading this non-profit and this movement?
Jay Pea
(42:35) I sometimes, not that I'm the strongest man in the world, but it reminds me of John Rambo, how he just wanted to be left alone. (42:44) I would have been happy just living my life quietly but they insisted on trying to change the clocks and I wouldn't stand for that. (42:53) I suppose it's helped me personally to be developing myself more professionally, to learn how to put better in words my thoughts and to present myself more professionally.
(43:07) It has been an interesting journey but throughout the whole thing I've never wanted it to be about myself. (43:13) I want it to be about the issue, about the history, about the science and about the core principles behind the matter. (43:19) We want to save standard time.
(43:22) We want to stay on standard because it's just naturally better for our health and safety. (43:29) These facts stand alone without any individual behind them. (43:38) That's where it lands for me.
Julian Hayes II
(43:40) Yeah, it does. (43:43) This thing really pierces into the fabric of society from the economics, from the health. (43:51) Health and economics tend to go together.
(43:53) If people are feeling sick, then they're not going to be as productive. (43:56) They're not going to affect the economics of the situation. (44:00) Every fabric of society operating is affected by this but a lot of times it's what I call invisible influencers.
(44:08) These things are invisible to the eye that you don't necessarily feel instantaneously but over time they're silently compounding. (44:15) Then you have a gradually and then suddenly moment.
Jay Pea
(44:19) Another factor for me too is just being honest about the time of day. (44:22) Again, I was taught to tell the time from the sun's position in the sky which is most akin to standard time, not daylight saving time. (44:29) Daylight saving time is a trick to make you wake up an hour earlier.
(44:33) Now if you really like waking up an hour earlier, then I say we should empower you to do so. (44:38) If you feel like your work day is starting too late and you want to start earlier, let's give you that autonomy. (44:45) Let's give you that authority over your own life.
(44:48) I find really that most people who say they like daylight saving time, they really just like the summertime. (44:55) Now if you're addicted to summer, then I guess you need to move to the equator or migrate like a bird throughout the seasons. (45:01) That's totally fine.
(45:02) A lot of people do that but I'm not a fan of trying to turn the clock into a liar to try to trick society into this system.
Julian Hayes II
(45:11) Yeah and so I'm curious, what's next? (45:14) What are you looking forward to in 2026?
Jay Pea
(45:17) Well in 2025 was the first year we got I think seven bills halfway to the finish line. (45:25) In 2024 was the first year we got one bill halfway to the finish line and two of these bills are still active. (45:33) Kansas Senate Bill 1 was approved by the Senate this year and it will come back to life in January and go through the House.
(45:41) If we could pass that bill then Kansas would be saying we'll take permanent standard time as soon as Missouri's ready to do it and then I can go to Missouri and say hey Kansas is ready to do this. (45:51) Nebraska also has a bill for permanent standard time that is still viable in 2026. (45:58) We would love to get that passed and it also is contingent on its neighboring states.
(46:04) If we can get just one state to pass a bill saying we'll accept permanent standard time even with the delayed effective date contingent on neighboring states that will make headlines and we can start pushing over these Donomos and move the entire nation to permanent standard time. (46:17) And of course every year in December and January we get a lot of new bills that I don't know are coming. (46:23) We're doing advocacy right now behind the scenes reaching out to our state legislators and I would implore you listening at home to call up your state legislator and say I want a bill for permanent standard time.
(46:34) It's already written for you. (46:35) Go to State Standard Time's website. (46:36) Please file this bill.
(46:38) We'll come out and we'll support it. (46:39) We'll testify. (46:41) So I'm really looking forward to what's ahead.
Julian Hayes II
(46:44) Awesome and I'm going to have that link in the show notes as well in case someone's driving or anything while they're listening to this and they'll be in the show notes. (46:54) And so where can listeners get involved more, support your work and even learn even more about you?
Jay Pea
(46:59) Yes please go to our website SaveStandardTime.com. (47:04) We have heaps of information there. (47:06) Tons of information.
(47:08) And we also have a button for subscribing to our email if you want to get an alert whenever there's something happening in your state. (47:14) And of course follow Save Standard Time on your favorite social media. (47:18) We have X, Blue Sky, Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, YouTube, several of these.
(47:26) So yeah we'd love to keep in touch with you all.
Julian Hayes II
(47:30) Yep they're everywhere and I'm on the newsletter as well. (47:32) There's great research. (47:34) I'm actually using some of the research for an upcoming article that they actually shared.
(47:39) So it's a fantastic resource. (47:40) It's a fantastic, it's the definitive I think source to really learn about this issue and then to share it with everyone else. (47:49) I cannot emphasize this enough that our circadian health is the foundation for everything.
(47:57) And so this is a very important issue. (47:59) So Jay thank you once again for joining me. (48:02) And listeners out there, stay awesome, be limitless and as always optimize today so you can lead tomorrow.
(48:10) Peace.
